Comments on Education Alternatives: The Blog for PathsOfLearning.net: Let's imagine an educational rights movement

I find it absurd that any ideas about democracy, s...

2007-02-11T11:15:00.000-08:00

I find it absurd that any ideas about democracy, social justice and education ignore the contribution to social justice that children continually make. In my 25 years in the profession and always on the side of children's rights I have met but a small handful of people who have serioulsy considered this. I do not find it here either.

If a child is not recognized for their contribtution to society than they will have to work at social justice. Most likely they will make the mistake of most people and as evidenced so far on this blog that somehow the cause can be reasoned into existence.

All the reasoning does is point to the isolation that most people feel. Social justice is a natural state and children who have been recongnized in their contribution, without making a big deal out of it, express it as a matter of course.

WOW! I am in awe and so charged to find this blog....

2007-02-09T21:23:00.000-08:00

WOW! I am in awe and so charged to find this blog. I'm beginning my senior research project for a BA at Cal State Monterey Bay on holistic edu. I'll be entering grad school soon to become a teacher--the conventional way, but I intend to follow the alternative pathway in teaching. I homeschooled my children for a few years back in the early 90s, educating myself in many of the ideologies and can't wait to get back into it all.
I have been trying to find like-minded people in my area to no avail-- yet. I'm almost done reading your book, Ron, What Are Schools For, have already read many of your articles and your book with Riane Eisler, Educating for a Culture of Peace. I'm a huge fan.
I'm just a novice in this whole endeavor, but plan to work toward greater expertise.
Please excuse my effusion/exuberance.

Thanks, Ron. I got around to starting my blog. Edu...

2007-01-31T22:03:00.000-08:00

Thanks, Ron. I got around to starting my blog. Education isn't the only focus, but it's critical to the things I'm thinking about there. (sacredawe.wordpress.com)

I went to school for many years in very controlling environments and given few options to make my own choices about what to learn or how to spend my time. Because of this I have a tendency to overcompensate, emphasising the importance of personal autonomy in education, but I've come to see that liberty, though very important, is not the highest value. I'm critical of the Sudbury Valley model as it seems to unnaturally emphasise the freedom of the individual, with little acknowledgement that the individual is always in relationship with others (influncing and being influenced by others is a part of life.) There is so much value in giving up some freedom to collaborate with a group, but it's understandable that people who have experienced one extreme might be highly critical about giving up any autonomy at all. But, as Nat Needle said a few weeks ago, most of us don't need that much freedom, and those who do could be considered spoiled. We do need, as you say, to respect the mystery, to help young people discover themselves -- which, I think, happen in community more than in isolation. Other values -- setting goals, learning to live together, finding purpose, working together to accomplish something remarkable -- are as important as liberty. The biggest issue may not be lack of liberty, but a lack of trust and respect. Where people feel trusted and respected, giving up a bit of personal autonomy is no big deal.

I think you're "rights-on" with the education idea...

2007-01-31T08:18:00.000-08:00

I think you're "rights-on" with the education idea. Although Dostoevsky and perhaps others expressed it earlier, Steiner took up the liberty-equality-brotherhood ideal of the French Revolution and made some sense of it. Rights are political, and that's where equality applies. Liberty is cultural, and educational content and goals belong there. Brotherhood, or solidarity, is economic: that should be focused on meeting our needs.

I find I get some clarity out of these distinctions, and perhaps it will help in your campaign. Especially the connection of liberty to that mysterious something that human beings have, and which education should respect and not impose on, but clear the way.

Hey Ron...you are correct..."czale" is your friend...

2007-01-24T22:09:00.000-08:00

Hey Ron...you are correct..."czale" is your friend Coop, who loves any discussion about democracy and freeing our spirits.

I agree with you that democracy involves common purposes and social endeavors in balance with personal autonomy, but I am convinced that its foundation is in the individual's ability to listen and choose to join in these purposes and endeavors. I see democracy as a process, an ongoing never ending process, of working yet again to some sort of consensus, whether of a majority or of all participants.

Common social purpose needs to be compelling enough to freely gain buy in from the individual and not to compell it, even if the majority is in agreement that this is for the individual's own good.

So Ron, what would be an example, in a learning (what you call "educational" setting), of an individual willingly yielding some of their personal preferences in order to serve a common good?